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    09 Dec 2010: Mugello

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    Gianfranco Pagoto
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    Join date : 2010-11-17

    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Gianfranco Pagoto on Fri Dec 10, 2010 1:56 am

    MikaRaymond wrote:Pagoto:

    Before you go off complaining about me, I would like to say im sorry for not letting you pass. Firstly, there were no blue flags. I saw none of them. After the lag crash, half the cars were boxes and I saw no flags - yellow OR blue. I did't cut you off or hit you in any way, I was clean and fair. Secondly, on the grid at the top, Lojelo was behind me and you looked like his car. I even took a screenshot during the race for proof:

    http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/7717/racer.jpg

    i find it offensive how you complained to Andrea AS SOON AS THE RACE FINISHED, without knowing facts. you KNOW im not an idiot driver - i was clean and fair, and never even came close to hitting you. I was simply following what i saw on my screen, so how would i know it was me you were talking to during the race?

    if you cant accept this public apology then we will not get on in the future. i stood up and admitted to it.

    thankyou.

    as far as my event went - utter shocking. i dont even want to talk about it.

    see you on the servers and grats to the winners!

    ok the problem is Solved

    Gianfranco Pagoto
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Gianfranco Pagoto on Fri Dec 10, 2010 1:59 am

    Ecco la mia gara incriminata.

    questo è il video di quello ke ho visto io.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm26Ph9euMs

    Preferisco manco commentare l'esito della gara.

    Oliver Kreuer
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Oliver Kreuer on Fri Dec 10, 2010 2:03 am

    Hi,

    started my first race from 5th i think. Race was very good. Lost few places in the beginng, cause of doing a bit slow in the beginning. In the end finished third, had a photofinish with someone. Very nice. we both had exactly the same time. So why am I the one on the third playce ;-)

    Second race. The start was not realy good. Someone hit me in the third corner (Rule 5) and i went in the sand. The track was clear so I drove back on. Someone came from behind and i wanted to let him pass, but in the next corner my car didnt took the corner properly, incase of the damage. What i didnt know at the moment.
    I pushed him of the track. Sorry for that it was not my purpose. After that i went to the box to repair my car. Then I drove without any mistakes till the end. The second time on the third position. Very nice.

    Can someone please watch the replay of Group C.(Only the beginning) Because the driving of this person was not ok.

    It was a nice event, so thx to everyone.

    M Waechter
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by M Waechter on Fri Dec 10, 2010 2:16 am

    Martin Hussey wrote:Absolutely terrible races. Race 1, my terrible setup cost me 6th. Got 7th which wasnt too bad, but didnt enjoy the race. Race 2, on lap 2 Waechter span in front of me, and i had nowhere to go. I sat out what i thought was 5 laps (and realised after going out that it had only been 4) then went back out. Couldnt keep the car on the track, frustration built up, i spun, hit the wall again, and when i escaped back to pit netkar closed. Doesnt matter, another 5 laps lost on top of what i was already down through spinning every 10 meters would have meant i wouldnt have even completed 50% of the race.

    Roll on the next race.

    Yes, it was difficult especially in the first sector where I did not dare to push in the first laps otherwise my car might have set on the ground.., but other cars behind me did push a bit too much there (because they had a better setup for the first laps maybe) so that I had no room for the handling of your my own car. Sometimes things were simply too close at those corners I have to say.. .

    A 'same' or at least kind of equal sad thing happened in race 1: I had a slower car in front of me around lap 6 or 7 and therefore I had to do slow also, but another driver behind me pushed too much in this situation (driving very close to me), so that we collided just because there was absolutely no room left in a corner. Some drivers (I dont speak of you now.. !) should sometimes calm down a bit and wait, instead of attaking at every impossible place on the track... !, because there were better places to try an overtaking than on the outside of this compact corners.
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    Marcello Gabrielli
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Marcello Gabrielli on Fri Dec 10, 2010 2:31 am

    Hi all

    last position in the qual, hitting a wall to let another driver pass -> go by myself to the box, repair, last position in race1 letting all the other drivers pass
    A LOT OF LAG
    2nd race, start from back waiting all the drivers pass in the 1st and 2nd curve. In the 3th curve my car was putted to the sky without touching the other cars. i ask the crew to check the replay. I was putted to the box, but after a while i was on the pitlane accelerating... thinking some automatic procedure, i continued the race to the end, going on grass when i saw other drivers behind me.
    No satisfaction at all due to very high lag and some strange driving of some other drivers.

    Waiting an expert driver who can adopt me, giving me some good setup and driving lessons, in oder to pass from "bradipo" to "tartaruga" state ;-)

    Bye
    Marcello
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    Paul O'Brien
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Paul O'Brien on Fri Dec 10, 2010 2:57 am

    Gianfranco Pagoto wrote:Ecco la mia gara incriminata.

    questo è il video di quello ke ho visto io.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm26Ph9euMs

    Preferisco manco commentare l'esito della gara.

    yeah i know how you feel .. you should see it from my view Very Happy

    Martin Hussey
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Martin Hussey on Fri Dec 10, 2010 3:17 am

    M Waechter wrote:
    Martin Hussey wrote:Absolutely terrible races. Race 1, my terrible setup cost me 6th. Got 7th which wasnt too bad, but didnt enjoy the race. Race 2, on lap 2 Waechter span in front of me, and i had nowhere to go. I sat out what i thought was 5 laps (and realised after going out that it had only been 4) then went back out. Couldnt keep the car on the track, frustration built up, i spun, hit the wall again, and when i escaped back to pit netkar closed. Doesnt matter, another 5 laps lost on top of what i was already down through spinning every 10 meters would have meant i wouldnt have even completed 50% of the race.

    Roll on the next race.

    Yes, it was difficult especially in the first sector where I did not dare to push in the first laps otherwise my car might have set on the ground.., but other cars behind me did push a bit too much there (because they had a better setup for the first laps maybe) so that I had no room for the handling of your my own car. Sometimes things were simply too close at those corners I have to say.. .

    A 'same' or at least kind of equal sad thing happened in race 1: I had a slower car in front of me around lap 6 or 7 and therefore I had to do slow also, but another driver behind me pushed too much in this situation (driving very close to me), so that we collided just because there was absolutely no room left in a corner. Some drivers (I dont speak of you now.. !) should sometimes calm down a bit and wait, instead of attaking at every impossible place on the track... !, because there were better places to try an overtaking than on the outside of this compact corners.

    I'm probably guilty of being a bit too close. I was trying to stay back as much as i could, but obviously, this is a race, so i was looking for a chance to get past you. You were braking early into the corners, so i was catching you there but letting you run ahead on the straights. I was hard on the brakes already when you started to slide, but there just wasnt enough room. Crying or Very sad

    M Waechter
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by M Waechter on Fri Dec 10, 2010 3:55 am

    No prob, I was sliding too much sometimes and there indeed I lost my car at least nearly, so you are not really guilty Wink.
    btw. just to mention: I was a bit slow in this situation because just a few meters before there was someone standing beside the track (left side), so I was slowing down a bit before to pass him savely and lost speed because of this... .
    I was probably braking a bit earlier because I drove with a bit less downforce (19 rear / 29 front) than others - i did that just to be able to set the aero at 0.0 % CP.

    my complete replay of race1+2, group B:
    http://www.filefront.com/17627627/RSR_KS2_Mugello_groupB_races.zip

    btw. (question to everyone): As I watched the incident around lap 6 with Foresta, I wonder why his car did not take any damage after we hit, because the collison was not that less... . ?
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    laurent resende
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by laurent resende on Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:26 am

    MERCI POUR LES REPLAYS MARCO Very Happy
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    laurent resende
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by laurent resende on Fri Dec 10, 2010 4:50 am

    I just watch the replay of the race 1 in Group B, my apologies to Daniel Gioia
    for the shock exit of T1, but the shock caused Naldi me at the back which returns me to the middle of the track, which naturally Naldi cons I wear a claim for breach of the security zone and dangerous driving mirror

    M Waechter
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by M Waechter on Fri Dec 10, 2010 7:58 am

    ehhm Laurent.. a thing I noticed when watching you in the replay - I don't want to mess around with apologies Neutral ..., but in your case just regarding race1 I have to mention:
    that after you crashed in the very beginning (ESC - back to pits) you went out on the track again after just 1 lap (not at least after 5 laps) -which was clearly not fullmode nature like..,
    so I would suggest this wrong 'behaviour' to be investigated by the race-directors.. Laughing . Suspect

    -I just have to mention that, because this cost me (and maybe another driver too) a position in the very back of the grid regarding the end-result list of the race [race 1].

    You were doing everything right and extremely fine on track afterwards btw. .. / enjoyed you to watch !, but -as I wrote- at the beginning as you crashed you ESC to pits and went out on track after a too short time.. .
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    Paul O'Brien
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    Incident Group A skittles

    Post by Paul O'Brien on Fri Dec 10, 2010 8:27 am


    Cédric Lagneau
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Cédric Lagneau on Fri Dec 10, 2010 9:28 am

    Race1 : very clean start and race with some good fight with Andrea Lojelo. Smile Fun and fair play.

    Race2: big lag and about ten cars crashed (same as Paul video , my eyes remember this rolling Shocked). Need to wait 5 laps...a ittle confuse for me to know exactly when to go out of stand. I restart and was around 12-13th place.
    But after about 15 laps suddenly screen feeze and i have a "netkar crashed" message box in windows Sad…Don't need to reboot it was netkar pro that crashed. FIRST TIME this append for me inside race. . Then i reconnect but netkar don't remember my laps . Netkar need some improvement regarding netcode and lag/reconnection case. It was a little frustrating but i know "it's the race" and i accept rules

    Thanks and see you next time,
    santa
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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 10:43 am

    Here is what happened at Mugello R2 Group A.
    No lag at all, just some very unfortunate sequence of events and exaggerated collisions (no doubt something Kunos needs to have a look at).



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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:17 am

    Results are up. In the Verification Team we are discussing about some penalizations so results are still not finalized.


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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:26 am

    Here are the report generated by Gek's nKLogAnalyzer for Mugello's races


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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:36 am

    looking at the logs, the first contact between Gek and Vanore, wasn't detected by Gek, so really nobody to blame there (unless you want to threaten Kunos asd )


    Andrea Lojelo wrote:Here is what happened at Mugello R2 Group A.
    No lag at all, just some very unfortunate sequence of events and exaggerated collisions (no doubt something Kunos needs to have a look at).




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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:57 am

    gabriele monti wrote:in the sencond "angry" turn
    sarebbe alla seconda delle arrabbiate? MEGA lol!


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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:02 pm

    Ulus Ulusalonur wrote:hi
    I know little english
    I am writing with google translate
    I started the first race, the pole position in group C
    began to race, one person ran into me the first bend
    I demand punishment for those people
    good night

    Ulus, please check your replay, and contact via PM to the other guy. In case you decide that a penalization should be inflicted, please let me know. Thanks


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    Michele Campini
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Michele Campini on Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:06 pm

    Guys,
    after read all your comment i've decided to left this champs.

    The reason is simple: Netkar is not ready for a KS2 champs, too many bugs.

    I since hope that Kunos will decide to spent his time to improve NetKar NETCODE and that he doesn't LOST TIME with the stupid rain.

    It's completely useless have the rain in race if U CANNOT do a "normal" race.

    Im My Honest Opinion.

    It's completely absurd and impossibile that in pool A (the "Fast Driver Pool") only 5 racers on 15 finish the race with all laps. Absurd and not real.

    Good Luck with the Champs and of course with the bugs (or lags) problems !

    Thanks to the RSR Team for spent his time with this champs and i hope that u make more pressure on Kunos for improve the Netcode.
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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:20 pm

    bye bye Michele! we are loosing, once more, a good driver.
    To be honest, I agree with you that netcode needs to be improved, but I think that you should have a closer look on each incident before you can say something about it. I spent some time analyzing that incident this morning, and as I wrote, it was a very unfortunate chain of events. Have you seen the replay? Reaction to the contact needs to be revised also, in my view, but I still think it's possible to drive this way and having a fair championship.
    We all need to be a bit careful, taking what we have so far.

    About the stupid rain...well...you should try it first!!!
    Kunos should think about his priorities first. I will push for sure for some improvements, as soon as he will be a bit more time.

    By the way, how was your track day? Please open a new topic and give us your feedback (and show us some videos/photos)!


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    Michele Campini
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Michele Campini on Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:27 pm

    Yes the problem is this one:
    "Reaction to the contact needs to be revised"
    but i think that is important improve the netcode and his behavior with the lags.
    Other sims can manage lags problems, so i hope that Kunos solve that problem.

    I saw the video of Pagoto ... OMG ... if a day one my race will finish in that way ...i'll be crazy LOOOL and in full mode his race was finish of course.

    So i'm a driver that like spent hours in training to do a good race and mistake can happens in a race, of course, but i cannot accept that my race finish for lags problem.

    I'm sure that u understand what i mean about that.

    My phrases on rain was a provocation, of course. But since for me is more important a good netacode respect the rain. Wink

    Tracks experience was beautiful, report is coming. Smile
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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:37 pm

    Michele Campini wrote:
    I saw the video of Pagoto ... OMG ... if a day one my race will finish in that way ...i'll be crazy LOOOL and in full mode his race was finish of course.

    this is what i'm saying. It's always a very bad habit to see a replay only from your point of view. there are reasons for things to happen. And in this case Pagoto and O'Brien, my self and many more drivers, were "killed" by some chain reactions of other cars that had multiple (unfortunate) contacts (gek>vanore; vanore>wall; Gajira>Gek; Vanore>Gek). This created a very powerful combination that create that mega incident. Having a closer look to it it doesn't seems to be as weird as it looks in the videos. Obviously contacts can be improved (in my view there is some error in the calculation of the speed of contact) because it's generating too much energy, and unrealistic dynamics.


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    Andrea Lojelo
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Andrea Lojelo on Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:56 pm

    Cédric Lagneau wrote:Race1 : very clean start and race with some good fight with Andrea Lojelo. Smile Fun and fair play.


    Race 1: great fun. Very clean and respectful race from everyone. Those are the kind of races I expected to find in group A. 13/15 drivers at the finish line without problems, very good battles on track and close results. It was funny to drive with a nice group of people in front of you for almost all the race. Very exciting.

    Race 2: well...you all have seen the mega incident!!! Anyway, from my point of view, it was, once again a clean start. Everyone gave space enough, then obviously that crash changed the end result, but... after 5 laps our race started again, and it has been very interesting and intense! 7-8 pilots started from the box after waiting 5 laps (except Pagoto that started immediately and is currently under investigation). I agree it was a bit confusing when was the right time to start again. I will try to specify it better in the rule. Anyway this was really a particular case with all those cars involved in a crash.
    From the "restart" of the race, it was once more great fun. While the guys in front were having their race, we were having ours, and was for good points also, so very interesting and challenging. I was amazed by my speed. Somehow I had almost the same pace of Vincenzo Vanore, usually seconds faster than me. We had good fun for few laps matching each other times. The I lost some time, and I decided to look at the classification keeping a good and steady pace, getting 2 more positions. The last one at 2 laps to the end, when I saw Mika going off track. I managed to overtake him and keep that position till the end.

    Over all 2 wonderful races for me, with very good end results.



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    Riccardo De Rosa
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    Re: 09 Dec 2010: Mugello

    Post by Riccardo De Rosa on Fri Dec 10, 2010 1:09 pm

    Michele Campini wrote:Guys,
    after read all your comment i've decided to left this champs.

    The reason is simple: Netkar is not ready for a KS2 champs, too many bugs.

    I since hope that Kunos will decide to spent his time to improve NetKar NETCODE and that he doesn't LOST TIME with the stupid rain.

    It's completely useless have the rain in race if U CANNOT do a "normal" race.

    Im My Honest Opinion.

    It's completely absurd and impossibile that in pool A (the "Fast Driver Pool") only 5 racers on 15 finish the race with all laps. Absurd and not real.

    Good Luck with the Champs and of course with the bugs (or lags) problems !

    Thanks to the RSR Team for spent his time with this champs and i hope that u make more pressure on Kunos for improve the Netcode.

    Michele, io trovo irreale utilizzare altri simulatori. Nk avrà il limite di 15 auto ma dalla mia esperienza ti posso dire che se tutti e 15 hanno una buona connessione problemi di lag io non ne ho visti. Per quell'incidente .... una caso perticolare, in una circostanza particolare che di certo non è normale ma sono casi limite.

    Mettendo sulla bilancia questi "problemi" con la sensazione di guida che offre Nk sicuramente penderà sulla sensazione di guida, sul feedback che questo simulatore riesce a dare anche se a volte si devono pagare questi problemi.

    Alcuni altri sim non hanno problemi di lag e ci si riesce a correre anche in 30 e passa ma preferisco correre in 15 con un simulatore che mi dà maggiore sensazione di guida. Preferisco insomma la qualità della guida alla quantità di piloti in pista.

    Ora sei arrabbiato perchè la tua gara è stata rovinata da una circostanza particolare ma mi auguro che tu ci ripensi ..... e capisca cosa sia più importante .... se simulare o fare finta di simulare in tanti.

    Se sei passato a Nk un motivo ci sarà..... e penso che sia proprio questo. Fai passare l'incazzatura e ripensaci.

    Ciao

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